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Floran: Bio-forging ; what is it and how it works.

Discussion in 'Unofficial Lore Discussion' started by Recluse, May 26, 2016.

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  1. Recluse

    Recluse New Member

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    Straight up copy paste from Kralion.

    "Alright this is straight up copy-pasted from the last server I put this on, so lets start.

    Floran tech
    Floran technology falls under two categories: Reverse-engineered or biotech. Reverse-engineered are all those that are made from scrap or pieces of salvaged tech, like their spaceships, while biotech is strictly that which is grown and made exclusively from florans, like needlers or their green plant lights.

    Reverse-engineered techology is a sort of shortcut for florans. It helps them enter the same advancement level of other races, but the end result is always inferior. There is nothing that stops a floran in the middle of a battle to use an assault rifle he found from an enemy, but florans, just like humans are naturally curious, are naturally stubborn in their belief that what they create is best. Even with ships or weapons that are obviously superior to their own, florans will always attempt to modify them in several ways, both to understand how it works and to "improve" it. The end result is technology that is prone to be faulty and inferior, but can be used by the floran. Sooner or later, however, this technology will fail and the floran is forced to to reverse-engineer more, as they have no means to understand how, or the precise tools, to fabricate advanced technology.

    Biotech is floran technology that has been created through the process of bioforging. Bioforging can be seen as a of advanced genetic system: Florans intergrate different features of plants and work until they get the result they want. For example, lets say I integrate a "Volcano plant" into the needler design. After mix and matching, a floran may end up with a result that spews forth needles with a molten core. Or, another result a floran ends up with a needler that shoots spines that ignite on contact. It's a process trial and error, almost, but florans can give nature a little "Push" in the direction they want by selectively cultivating two results together. In short, a mix of gene therapy and selective crop growing. Basic bioforging could produce weapons like a whip made of vines and needles, maybe with some special characteristics like making the thorns feed on blood. Medium-tier bioforging would be floran needlers or "rifles" that spit out acid that eats through non-organic material. Advanced bioforging can produce anything, even advanced spaceships that feed on biofuel. Below is an example.

    (Please note that a floran tribe being capable of producing spaceships out of nothing but plant matter would be the equivalent of a modern country gaining nuclear power. In other words, very few floran tribes are capable of it.)

    [​IMG]

    Greenfinger and the Greenguard
    Greenfinger is the most sucessful floran huntmaster to this day. His warband achieved the incredibly task of ransacking the Hylotl homeworlds hundreds of years ago, thanks to their cunning and incredibly advanced biotech. It is even said that the design of the floran needler and the saplights that provide florans light without burning them are his creations.

    In the current date, Greenfinger hasn't been spotten for years, likely still keeping a low profile from the enormous bounty on his head. Some spaceships and colony words, however, have still been raided by the Greenguard, the description of the attackers matching the ones from the Hylotl homeworld, but these are nothing but skirmishes. While some suspect Greenfinger may have simple perished, florans are known to violently deny this claim, insisting he is "ssstill killing ssstupid frogmen like good Floran!"

    Greenfinger is still seen as a great figure in floran lore, something that all florans should aspire to. Joining his Greenguard would be seen amongst the greatest of honors.

    Floran numbers
    Whatever process the florans use to mate, two things are clear: One, the end result are several "fertilized" seed which are then planted into the ground. Two, florans can "cultivate" their seedlings like almost any crop. All they require is sunlight, water and compost. Floran mating usually produces around three to nine seeds. The seed will eventually grow into a large pod, which in about six months produces a small floran which, compared to humans, would be physically around six years old.

    Floran seedlings are notorious for being voracious from the moment they emerge, often fighting with their own brothers and sisters mere minutes after they are born to feed on their flesh. Some floran tribes allow the young ones to fight, only letting the fittest survive, while others take great care in ensuring that all their young ones live to see the day.

    In but four mere years, the voracious seedling will use all the acquired biomass and protein to turn into a fully grown floran adult, dubbed a "sprout". Mentally, of course, they are very different. Most tribes allow their wisemen and shaman to teach these young adults in the ways of the hunt, bioforging and survival in a period of over several years or so. Once their training is complete, usually at the age of 18, these sprouts have finally earned the title of floran. However, it is not unheard for tribes engaged in conflict to simply dump these wild, foolish adults with the mind of children into the conflict, letting their instincts run wild.

    Being a unisex race, the florans have no need to protect their females nor are slowed down by pregnancies. Floran pods require little maintenance other than feeding them and scaring predators. With just two florans stranded in a planet, they can have a full tribe running in but a mere decade. It is no wonder why they are considered the most numerous, and potentially dangerous, race in the universe.


    The myth of the pacifist Floran
    A tale usually told by Hylotl with too many fetishes. The idea is that, simply enough, some florans have managed to leave behind their violent ways and tribal culture to "ascend" and join the other races in civilization. The truth is a resounding no. While floran tribes may have different degrees of violence, they all share the aspect that "rotten" sprouts or seedlings that cannot adapt to their violent lifestyle must be "returned to the dirt", usually by killing them, eating the corpse and then planting their bones, usually their skull, into the dirt, hoping that next time they hatch they will be "improved" This is not to say that any floran that is not a hunter is killed, but those that simply show a complete and utter refusal to violence or violence. Even outside of tribes, florans are known to still follow this violent part of their culture.

    It is not unheard of, however, of florans managing to somewhat adapt to civilization. Some florans find their place as hunters or traders, but their violent culture is still very much present. Minor offenses that other races would shrug off would maybe earn you a savage bite that a floran may consider a "warning", not to mention the somewhat casual relationship florans have with the cycle of life and death. In fact, a quite common act between florans is to "spar" with their claws, teeth and fists until one of them is finally unconcious. Sufficient to say, a great deal of florans are usually jailed for murder.

    (Now start discussing this and tell me how shit I am.)"


    tl;dr let's get some bio-forging going on and some cooler floran lore potential as well as physical traits.
     
    #1 Recluse, May 26, 2016
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  2. Recluse

    Recluse New Member

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    Copy paste from Kralion on physical traits.

    Physical Traits Proposal/Thoughts by Kralion

    "Florans probably have a somewhat developed sort of night vision. Think of it as D&D Darkvision, as they can only see 60 feet ahead of them or so.

    I understand how people are wary of bioforging due to its OP potential, so I'll try to raise some points.

    First, to create a weapon that could fire "spikes filled with acid-melting armor and poison" would take far, far too much time for a floran shaman. Floran bioforging sort of forces the floran to focus on one specific objective with his weapon and not branch out too much or risk losing what he already made. A floran shaman may be able to produce a needler that bursts into smaller needles after it impacts a target, or maybe make the main needle have a poison which will make the target dizzy and cause nausea. If the shaman focuses too much on developing an extremely powerful toxin for the needle, he would risk making the needle lose some of its properties. It may not even be able to survive the velocity at which it is launched from the needler. Another last example may be a floran bio-acid weapon that spits acid, think of pitcher plants, that can corrode through non-organic with enough quanity, but would leave naught but a chemical burn on contact with skin.

    Second, a floran cannot decide to bioforge with just plants that grow on his backyard. A floran would have to scur through the different plant species of their planet to find the one right for its job, if it is even on the same planet. It may require special temperature, compost or soil. In other words, no floran shaman is going to be shitting out needlers in just a week.

    Third, how difficult the process of bioforging is. It is a task delegate only to tribe shamans for a reason, after all. Floran sprouts are usually taught by their shaman how to grow incredibly basic equipment, such as a strong vine covered in hooked horns that can be used as a whip or a pair of bolas that burst into entangling roots on contact, but anything that could be classified as a sort of "firearm" would require the patience and knowledge of a triban shaman." Kralion​
     
    #2 Recluse, May 26, 2016
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  3. Recluse

    Recluse New Member

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    tl;dr everything

    1. Florans can bio forge if they train their entire lives in the art of 'connecting' to nature that they them-self's are. Not every Floran will know how. It takes a truly special shaman to do this.
    2. Florans have physical traits that allow them to see in the dark. They have night vision up to 60 M like a normal earth predator.
    3. Florans can live up to a thousand years, until they begin taking part of a process that I will nickname "rooting" in which the Floran begins taking the process of growing as a tree. It is a very bad way to go, and most die before even thinking this could happen. It's extremely rare, and most Florans die before twenty anyway.
    4. A new infection proposal to explain how Florans can have mushrooms on them as well as fungus, despite fungi not being apart of the plant kingdom. This means florans have no control over fungi in bio forging. Florans, when growing in the seed during the six months of growth in the 'womb', if fungi enters somehow, than it will be present on the Floran during birth. It is an infection, however, it requires stagnant growth. This means, you must be still, alive, and in an environment compatible with the fungi. It is not a strength, for the fungi is simply an ammonia smelling mess. For some though, it's a status symbol... for some stupid reason.
    5. "By god, this is over powered!" In a way, it is. This certainty does give florans the means to grow their weaponry, as well as the means to have better ranged combat, better melee, better sneaking even. However, as we are in an alien setting, where fantasy metals exist, I think it is fair to say that with proper time constraints, skill constraints, as well as plant restraints(you need the right kind of plant for what you want).
      (EDIT; Should make it known that it's mainly comedy material saying "It's overpowered." Because it should be noted that their equipment is very inferior.)
     
    #3 Recluse, May 26, 2016
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  4. zkkzz

    zkkzz New Member

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    I'll respond to the TLDR for sake of ease.

    But if every tribe has a special shaman, what's the difference? In the end, the tribe will still end up with bioforged weapons. Sure, it diverges a little from Wreth shenanigans and growing guns on the spot, but not very much.

    ok

    I don't understand why this is that necessary but I guess it'll help them hunt.

    Florans living up to a thousand years "but most dying before twenty" is just... dumb. I don't know why you would say this. Why do Florans need to be even more of special snowflake overpowered messes. Don't do this. It's shit.

    uh
    for what purpose
    isn't this a thread about fucking bioforging
    Like, you say "better ranged combat! better melee! better sneaking!" without any indication what that means. Adding shitty OVERPOWERED Floran mechanics doesn't arbitrarily improve combat roleplay just in of itself, you have to explain why it would do so. And the few arguments you HAVE used haven't convinced me. You JUST said it's OVERPOWERED. How can you even argue for yourself when you blatantly admit that it's bad?

    Bioforging gets crazy and shitty when you get to advanced technology like ACID GRENADE LAUNCHERS and FIREARMS. I don't think--



    HOW??!?!??!?!??!? How would a ship be made entirely out of plant matter and bioforging? If we're willing to do that, where does the line end? If you're willing to make engines and airtight compartments out of PLANTS, what the fuck is stopping you from making fully-functioning guns? HGRAUUGHHGH

    This just... harkens back to the old days when bioforging was cancer. And I wasn't around enough, so take what I say with a grain of salt, but I don't think we want those old days again, and this looks pretty fucking similar. Just IMHO.

    I know you're an OE person who doesn't want their speshul floran communnityy to lose some of its powers, but this is a different server, and not all of the stuff is going to make it through.

    Just my 2c
     
    #4 zkkzz, May 26, 2016
  5. DeltaV

    DeltaV New Member

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    I agree 100% with zkkzz on all of his points. Especially it suddenly being introduced that they can live for a thousand years.
     
    #5 DeltaV, May 26, 2016
  6. zkkzz

    zkkzz New Member

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    DeltaV-Today at 9:30 AM
    i already debated how from a scientific standpoint bioforging makes no sense at all this time yesterday
    anyone who only has spears sucks at range

    DeltaV-Today at 9:30 AM
    that's why they make ranged weapons
    you think the concept of something that fires a projectile a long distance is something that a floran couldn't figure out?
    zkkzz-Today at 9:30 AM
    bio forging makes zero scientific sense and only exists so that florans can be more powerful

    Recluse-Today at 9:31 AM
    fantasy metals make zero scientifis sense and only exists so that races can be more powerful


    ^^^I'm glad you demonstrate 0 knowledge for Antares community or lore by claiming that there are still fantasy metals (beyond Durasteel) in use and that they exist to make races more powerful



    Recluse-Today at 9:33 AM
    in OE lore, the Hylotls used chemical warfare against the Florans and still lost.


    ^^^This isn't OE anymore and frankly that sounds retarded.
     
    #6 zkkzz, May 26, 2016
  7. zkkzz

    zkkzz New Member

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    More discussion in chat I want to bring up here.

    You have no scientific basis. You pretend that you do but as we start discussing it's clear that bioforging is just space magic with bells and whistles. A pitcher plant producing hydrochloric acid makes zero sense. It'd be nice if you admitted that it is just space magic so we can discuss whether or not it's good for the server instead of whether or not it's realistic. Because it's not, IMHO.
     
    #7 zkkzz, May 26, 2016
  8. zkkzz

    zkkzz New Member

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    DeltaV-Today at 10:20 AM
    anyways i've gtg so i'll wrap up my arguments. Bioforging is bad because it doesn't make sense from a scientific standpoint and unnecessary because florans aren't some magical separate thing from the rest of the galaxy that can't figure out how to use guns. Huge lifespans are bad because they don't make sense from a scientific stand point and unnecessary because they add nothing besides the opportunity to make 999-year-old special snowflakes. In short, florans don't get to be special because they're florans. They still should have to obey the basic rules of science.



    ^^^Just posting snippets from chat so they're not removed. I don't fully agree with this one because already some races defy science.
     
    #8 zkkzz, May 26, 2016
  9. Reconus

    Reconus Moderator
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    I feel that copy pasting the entire thread wasn't the best idea to show off the single point of bioforging but okay nevermind whoops.
    Seriously, I recommend cutting it down to the meat needed for the idea. Just to avoid confusion.
    Firstly - if they still exist of course because chucklefuck randomly removing items from the game - wouldn't floran needlers be essentially the floran version of a fully functional gun?
    As for the note on ships, yes, it may seem unrealistic but the idea of being able to produce bio-organic ships (after a long period of time of course, dependant on the... "class" of vessel, probs even going up to several years for frigates) is an interesting one. On top, I honestly see little it has that surpasses normal vessels - yes, they can in theory regenerate wounds, but so can every organic; slowly. The only armour they would have by default if any would be a thin but hardened carapace/bark to deflect micro-meteoroids. It's not going to fare well to ballistic ordinance, however, unless more adequate armour is in place.

    If anything, It's potential unique flavour for a race - organic technology.
    Oh, that.
    That was funny because I believe he actually ordered plants to grow grenades.
    Ordered.

    Bioforging would actually need floran input, like agriculture almost. But... well, I guess far more complex in that matter.
    However the reasoning for a tribe to not pursue the path of bio-forging - or maybe not even discover it in the first place end of - is the fact that salvaged technology is MUCH easier to obtain than waiting ages to grow your own whilst having to feed the damned thing and such. Why should I grow a needler when I can pry that machine gun from the cold, dead hands of my victims?
    Or living hands maybe if just up front stealing.

    Other factors that may play into effect are those of: knowledge (or lack of), population (can't feed a ship without the hunters), food supply (see before), rivals (people to steal normal technology off), and in theory specimens (can't induce properties without a template to work off.)
     
    #9 Reconus, May 26, 2016
  10. Haplap

    Haplap Happypaps

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    Just responding to tl;dr as well, main post was a bit too long for me to really put my full, undivided attention on to really absorb it. My bad.
    1. Sure, I agree with that. It'd take time to understand how to do this.

    2. I guess? Is that 60 Miles? Or 60 Meters? I'm gonna assume meters, because miles doesn't fit the bill at all. That's fine, I guess.

    3. That's way longer than any race, and rooting sounds rather un-floran like. Even Novakids don't live that long, I believe. Lower their life expectancy, imo. Next, they're living beings of plant, so what's prompting them to grow into trees? Isn't that a devolution? If anything, they'd keel over and die like all the rest of the races, considering there really isn't anything that would logically make them 'root', in my opinion.

    4. This sounds like something you'd write for a singular character. Not something that needs to be included for regular floran lore, really. There's really no benefit/hindrance to having them, so it's not something that's needed in lore.

    5. We are in an alien setting, sure, but we do hold a degree of realism to our RP. That's important. So long as you sufficiently explain how the bio forged stuff they make works, then it's probably okay. But with the ship thing, that's a certain no-go. They'd need to salvage parts from an actual ship and probably use the framework of a ship at least to make an actual bio forged ship. So no full plant ships imo, they need actual spaceship parts for that.

    This was a weak response, but whatever. Have it.
     
    #10 Haplap, May 26, 2016
  11. Khaltor

    Khaltor Lore Master

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    Yah, and you pretty much said what I'd already said as well :p...
     
    #11 Khaltor, May 26, 2016
  12. Haplap

    Haplap Happypaps

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    A for affert, haplap. good don e
     
    #12 Haplap, May 26, 2016
  13. Khaltor

    Khaltor Lore Master

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    Yeah, no this is true.
    That's canon.
     
    #13 Khaltor, May 27, 2016
  14. Recluse

    Recluse New Member

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    I can work with the compromises put forth by Hap. I disagree still on a few things, but overall, I agree and am happy to hear we're reaching a middle ground.
     
    #14 Recluse, May 27, 2016
  15. Awe

    Awe Gotta go fast!

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    [​IMG]
     
    #15 Awe, May 27, 2016
  16. November

    November Previously Sermane
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    So from a scientific standpoint, the concept of plants as a projectile weapon isn't entirely out of the question. There are a good number of species that use explosive dehiscence or what is termed "rapid plant movement" to disperse seeds/pollen. The fastest known is the Morus alba which launches pollen at half the speed of sound.

    Now, you may say "But Sermane, that's pollen which is like...tiny" and you're correct. There's something amazing about plants specifically, and that is the power of selective breeding and gene manipulation. Now this is unfortunately where I have to get into some "it happens because" bullshit, but would it be so terrible to allow Florans to manipulate genes in plants? Now obviously this doesn't mean that it turns plants into assault rifles, because if it did the military would be researching the fuck out of it. What it can do is allow for small things, like a wood that is as firm and sharp as metal, or growing lamp plants. In advanced societies, you may see bio-electric generators for more complex systems (and by advanced societies I mean tribes of 100+ Florans that we don't have).

    Florans have an edge when it comes to agriculture, I think we can all agree on that. It comes from understanding plants in an innate manner that animals just don't have. Even if arguably Florans have more in common with Mammalia than Plantae, their own bio-mechanisms provide some basis for advanced kinesis in plants.

    So what ideas do I have besides them being flavourful replacements for materials? Well I'm glad you asked. I think the maximum power you can expect a Floran tribe on the server to accomplish is that of a flintlock musket. It fires a pellet at subsonic speeds using a mechanism that can take a good half minute to reload. A lot of plants have very rapid action mechanisms, like the snapping of a venus flytrap, but even those can take days to open back up. Now even if humans were to spend time making the perfect flytrap, I think could do pretty well. Eliminate the research time into the specific mechanisms to give Florans their innate edge in plants, and I don't see why a small tribe or even an individual could develop small plantlike grenades (really not a complicated mechanism) or simple muskets.

    But that's just what I think.
     
    #16 November, May 27, 2016
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  17. Daenynia

    Daenynia New Member

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    Okay, first off, no florans are making any ships from just biotic materials, okay? Like I'm sorry, spaceships need propulsion, fuel, oxygen generation, computer systems, the ability to be equipped with systems such as a an ftl drive and propulsion control, among other things.

    This wouldn't work because well, let's go over the list:

    Propulsion, the only known propulsion techniques that plants can naturally produce are spore plumes which spurt pressurized spores and air when their sensory organs are triggered. Past that, you MIGHT be able to get away with potential and kinetic energy, like producing a temporary helicopter via twisting a set of vines in a spring set up enough that releasing them would provide lift.

    Fuel, plants require several of a few types of fuel to perform, being that this space ship is a plant-based organism. Plants require oxygen, carbon dioxide, water, nutrients, and sunlight, among other things. In space there is none of this except for sunlight, so fueling such a large and need-be capable vessel would be near impossible without towing GIANT TANKS of water, food, oxygen and carbon dioxide.

    Oxygen Generation, Your florans need to breath, whether it be oxygen or carbon dioxide, they need to breath, your ship would have to produce both of these things at a VERY VERY VERY PRECISE rate, and you would somehow have to insulate the exterior, because the plant-based ship would just exert all of this stuff to the exterior and float off into space. In addition to this, even if you say, trapped a bubble of planetary air inside this vessel, your space-ship would have to be completely insulated letting off no air and also you wouldn't be able to go on for long because even as a floran you don't produce the same amount of oxygen as carbon dioxide, so the levels in the air would be completely off.

    Computer Systems, No, your floran cannot mind control a ship, and no you cannot augment a completely plant based organism with a mechanical system, especially one as high tech as a 4th dimensional flight computer. So, no.

    Mechanical Equipment, This function is nessicary because planetary systems are so far apart that without an ftl drive or a high speed thruster system, you'd be coasting through space over a period of years!!! In many scenarios, entire settlements might be vacant and abandoned by the time your floran horde on board this ship would even reach them, because it'd take that long(IF YOU EVEN GOT PROPULSION ENOUGH TO GO AT A DECENT SPEED(USING PLANTS!!!)) And as I said before, plant matter cannot be controlled by or united to a mechanical system, so nah.

    On terms of weaponry and mechanical purposed biotech

    So, let's say you want to reverse engineer a weapon, or incorperate maybe metal or a non-plant material into your plant based weaponry, well you can ONLY GROW PLANTS AROUND IT, it will not become part of your weapon, only a non-compatible carry-on which can serve a purpose, but never truly be part of your weapon.

    Past this, florans aren't magical super beings, in the most radical of scenarios and lore, florans have a sort of "psychological empathy" to lesser mentally dominant plants, like many fictional races across many games and settings, they would have a purposed psychological ability, but not extend to other things like making super psy blasts or stuff like that. So, they would be able to influence and emphasize with plants to make them grow a certain way. Another explanation is special pollen or pheromones which are used to grow plants in a special way instead of the whole mind thing.

    This applies to biotech making because a floran could then construct and grow intriquite shells for guns like needlers, which would then use pressurized air or even a spore explosion to launch the projectiles out. A limit to this sort of idea is, a plant has to be able to be made into it, which means moving mechanical parts would be complicated to naturally grow, in addition, your floran would have to physically study the art of manipulating plants and such. A new sapling or retarded hunter won't be able to bend plants and grow giant trees, they'd have to actually learn these things.

    Let's get past need for weapons though, it's all about the shooty things aint it? Biotech could be illustrated in the event of creating a crane, using physical properties to allow a floran to easily lift heavy objects for traps or transport. Also creating slingshot sleds which are specially made for low friction on a jungle/rainforest floor. Creating a transparent bio-glass is also something that has been done in current nature and could be done through bio-tech. This could help with structure construction and lights and stuff have already been talked about. Lights work via phosphorous reacting and creating a natural glow. In the real world, plant lights would be multi colored and be very unsual compared to what we have in game.

    I believe bio-tech itself has no limits, but at the same time it does, like you can make anything a plant could be formed into, and even perform things like increasing the density of plant-stone or plant-stone like material and ultimately making cheaper armor than metal that has somewhat the same strength with some benefits and consequences. You can create structures and vehicles which rely on potential energy in the form of tension and even gliders and sleds. But, at the same time, you will not be making a giant combine harvester, slaughtering entire worlds. You will not be making giant space ships that are instant healing and undefeatable. You will not be controlling giant thorny vines like a fantasy rpg game that entangle enemies and rip them to pieces, any plant control would be definitely slow and really with most constructions, the bigger it is, the harder and slower it is to produce, using more energy, resources, and generally bodily power.

    I'm sure I'm leaving out things here, I'm sure I could keep ranting about why things wouldn't work, and what would, but I can't think of anything because I'm kinda lazy atm, so meh c:
     
    #17 Daenynia, May 31, 2016
  18. Reconus

    Reconus Moderator
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    I feel that a few of the things you have mentioned are in fact explainable, and perhaps maybe even viable, even if I feel the logic is not the "how", but the "what" and how to make that "what" not eclipse the other races.

    Floran consoles and control surfaces are supposedly made from wood, maybe even presumably grown, and are legitimate objects in the game, so would presumably exist. One could in theory "wire" up such a surface to react to certain stimuli - in this case, touch. It would respond almost like a nervous system - one "button" or what you may call it a specific "nerve" to then carry on a message. Maybe similar to how florans operate, in that regard of stimuli and responses.

    And who is to say - a 'vehicle' won't have a brain of it's own? If anything, a chieftain or pilot would be ordering it around like a well trained pet, telling it what to do and where to go, only controlling what they would need to control. Like 'doors' or what have you.

    A large tribe will have to maintain a large ship - it is as simple as that. That means hunting and gathering supplies should not be an issue, if anything. A single hunter will maybe be able to sustain a "fighter" sized craft quite reasonably if they could drag an entire kill along with it. An entire tribe? They can bring in /feasts/ and down prey many sizes bigger than them through co-ordination and strategy - just how we hunted mammoths in the good old days.
    It seems only logical that way.

    Ships may even be akin to whales, almost. You say they would require oxygen and carbon dioxide (even though I thought oxygen was a waste product of plants) - large, interior stores to hold all this in, and then go on through the void - as if it were holding it's breath. Then you skim the atmosphere of a garden world or what else would be suitable, soak in those needed gases to refill, before setting back off again.

    Propulsion: seemingly difficult for space travel, yes. Atmospheric would be easy - wings, maybe even 'vents' to blast out gases - a crude mimic of hover engines. Ground, we can easily go for legs or 'hover', as later mentioned.
    However, space could still be viable - if maybe slow. Carefully bio-forged wings could act as solar sails to carry the ship along. The jettisoning of waste gases could then act for manoeuvring.

    Heat and insulation seems simple - many Arctic life has blubber to act as insulation. It would seem suitable to use the same properties of that material (perhaps having to be better however, seeing space is no joke) to keep in the heat and keep out the cold. Organic life also produces heat natural form it's bodies - and volcano plants are in fact a thing, apparently - so such strains could be utilised to replicate that effect and act as an organic heater.

    Erchius is not /actually/ seemingly explained much - the supposed source of FTL technology at it's core, where 'it just works', unless I'm mistaken and have missed something. The properties of Erchius could possibly induce strange bonding with organic matter (see erchius mutants if they're still a legit thing) and in such a case, could possibly create an organic 'FTL drive' through that method.

    More complex machines - say a teleporter - could simply be brought on board the vessel and slapped down in the interior spacing with a genny or what have you to power it.

    The plant control idea I feel is terrible - on the level of ordering plants to grow grenades just because they said so. You /can't/ control that which cannot respond in the first place. Psychic waves or no, I feel that it is both unnecessary and makes little sense - a plant cannot receive a command if it has no thinking behind it, no brain. For all we know, a plant acts purely on /it's/ instinct, which seems to compose of "do x when y is true" or "look at sun whenever possible." The only exceptions would be florans, and more complex engineer constructs, such as 'vehicles', and even then why would the floran have developed such an ability in the first place when it would never become prominent or be used in earlier stages of evolution?

    Indeed, the best path for bio-forging would be innate( maybe not even that - just general knowledge?) understanding of bio-forging at it's basics - the splicing of genetic data to create new 'lifeforms' to further the interests of the tribe. Be it weapons, tools, 'vehicles', bio-chemicals, maybe even homes, or whatever else have you.

    That is all I have for now to say about your suggestions.
     
    #18 Reconus, Jun 1, 2016
  19. Daenynia

    Daenynia New Member

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    If you look at the sprite for the plant control panel, it's literally 2 buttons, which could easily just be pressure kept lever operated switches, the in game wiring isn't canon at all, it's simple an easy-do linking apparatus.
    I never said vehicles made from plants wouldn't be living organisms
    All plant cells need oxygen to live, because without oxygen they can't perform aerobic respiration (respiration is the process of breaking down food to get energy). Of course you probably know that when plants perform photosynthesis, they combine water, carbon dioxide, and the sun's energy to produce sugar and oxygen. They use the oxygen produced and oxygen collected from between dirt particles in the roots to help with burning the sugar to collect the energy to live.
    Yes, I agree with the ideas behind using waste gasses and solar sails, but in realistic roleplay, no one wants to wait years to travel lightyears away to another solar system.
    Plants would not be able to break down erchius fuel, natural plant life does not run on fossil fuels, plants either produce their own food, or carnivorous plants break down insects, lizards, frogs, and other prey for energy. Erchius fuel is a very radical and unpredictable substance as well, which would probably be incapatible with plant life.
    In terms of controlling plants and how they grow, I leave that to khaltor and those who actually decide how things work on antares.
     
    #19 Daenynia, Jun 2, 2016
  20. Khaltor

    Khaltor Lore Master

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    It all depends on how far you want to take it.
    You could create a fusion of ship parts and highly genetically altered super plants to create hybrid ships, part biotic and part mechanical, and then give a somewhat vague explanation as to how it would function. (I tried that in the past.)
    I also think this is what CF initially had in mind, but later they may have changed their mind and chose to go with the overgrown, stolen Apex ship instead.
    [​IMG]
    However, even it seems somewhat plausible, general consensus is that we ought /not/ to do that.
    Florans, Novakid and starbound in general require a certain amount of suspension of disbelief, however bio-ships, like Zerg Overlords and Tyranid Hivefleets are generally viewed as overkill.

    On the topic of plant-based machinery, that could work, as it would most likely just mimick the structure of normal machines, with conductive vines fulfilling the same functions as wiring, to connect with normal machines. I just don't think it'd be worth the effort if you'd try to create any kind of more complicated machinery. (especially considering it'd be a pain in the ass to replicate microchips, perhaps even impossible)

    Tl;dr:
    Static things like furniture = ok.
    Weapons, bio-forged as a hybrid between plant material and conventional materials. = ok.
    Spaceships = not ok, maybe overgrown on the inside but no bio-ships, and perhaps dead plant matter on the outside.
    Poison-Ivy-esque real time plant mobility manipulation/making things grow so fast that you can "see" it, is a big no-no. No vine tentacle rape bullshit.
     
    #20 Khaltor, Jun 2, 2016
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